Comments on: Breaking: The Pope is NOT Dope

By: PhDork

PhDork — Wed, 18 Mar 2009 20:32:45 +0000

I think it’s really dangerous to talk about “Africans” in any context, contrarian, but especially if you’re throwing around judgments. There are 61 territories and more than 900 million people on that continent, with more ethnic groups, languages and faith traditions than I can count.

I’ve heard of “dry sex,” and I don’t doubt that it is a cultural complication, but nobody needs the Pope (or anyone else) talking shit like “condoms are the problem.” Cameroonians need the Pope (and everyone else) saying “condoms prevent disease,” “it’s cool to use condoms,” “it isn’t ‘manly’ to spread disease,” etc. And they need education, and free condoms, and medical care to contol the spread of HIV. Not lies and bullshit, or racially-dodgy talk about “culture.”

By: jdregent

jdregent — Wed, 18 Mar 2009 20:22:06 +0000

I don’t think we necessarily disagree, contrarian. I work on health in subsaharan africa so i’m aware of the issues you speak of, however i would argue that most of that goes to issues of development and the status of women. which brings us back to laughingrat’s point. If the pope was saying, condoms won’t stop aids because the status of women is too low to allow them to meaningfully negotiate safer sex practices, then I would agree with him. But that’s not what he’s saying. He’s saying that condoms are bad because they promote and spread unchaste behaviors, which has been proved to be incorrect by many studies which I can find and link you to if you’d like. I’d also point out that that salon article is very old, and the reasons for the high rate of HIV in certain subsaharan african countries is very complex and can’t be reduced to a preference for dry sex (this is also not a universal practice in high HIV incidence areas). Condoms, in concert with many other interventions, do indeed have a demonstrable effect on rates of HIV transmission. Of course you can’t just distribute them absent education and information. But who besides the Pope thinks that is what anti-AIDS practitioners are suggesting?

By: contrarian

contrarian — Wed, 18 Mar 2009 19:59:18 +0000

does he think subsaharan africans are just more reckless sexually than the rest of the world? is that why they carry 65% of the world’s HIV load?

They are, and yes.

Many Westerners get uncomfortable about judging cultural practices, especially w.r.t. Africans because of our long, nefarious history. And I sympathize with that view, but in this case it is absolutely correct to blame reckless sexual practices (specifically, male insistence on “dry sex” with women) for the high rates of HIV infection. [Unless your idea of responsible sexual behavior includes rubbing dirt mixed with babboon urine into the vagina immediately before sex.]

More info, if you dare:

http://www.salon.com/health/sex/urge/world/1999/12/10/drysex/

BTW, I’m not Catholic and I do favor condom usage (both locally and globally), but in this instance the Pope is probably correct that condoms won’t reduce the spread of HIV because (1) African men won’t wear condoms even if they’re available, (2) African women are raised not to question or refuse African men’s desires, and (3) dry sex means many (most?) condoms would break anyway. Culture trumps condoms, I’m afraid.

Condoms certainly won’t increase HIV, though; that’s just stupid.

By: BeckySharper

BeckySharper — Wed, 18 Mar 2009 19:23:34 +0000

Unfortunately, JPII was just a kinder, gentler, more crowd-friendly face for the same hard-line misogyny. Remember, Ratzinger was JPII’s henchman when he ran the Inquisition (which has been re-branded as “Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith”). A lot of JPII’s conservative policy bullshit came straight from Ratzy. They were a bit like Bush and Cheney.

By: Rachel S.

Rachel S. — Wed, 18 Mar 2009 18:57:06 +0000

Yes, be moral and responsible: BY USING A GODDAMN CONDOM!!!

By: jdregent

jdregent — Wed, 18 Mar 2009 18:23:13 +0000

JPII was decidedly not better on this issue. He was the one who really harped on contraception being evil. This is actually Benny’s first statement on it as pope.

By: DangerMouse

DangerMouse — Wed, 18 Mar 2009 17:56:57 +0000

Can we have JPII back please? I mean, not ideal, but better….

By: Laughingrat

Laughingrat — Wed, 18 Mar 2009 16:31:08 +0000

*bows*

When I’m Pope, cheese is gonna be the new sacrament.

That would be an awesome internet meme. “When I’m Pope, I’ll…”

By: SarahMC

SarahMC — Wed, 18 Mar 2009 15:59:09 +0000

Laughingrat FTW!

LOL @ Soalg, too.

By: sarah.of.a.lesser.god

sarah.of.a.lesser.god — Wed, 18 Mar 2009 15:57:58 +0000

Laughingrat >>>>>>>>>> Laughing Ratzinger.