Comments on: Yes, I really do think about stuff this way.

By: thenew21

thenew21 — Tue, 28 Dec 2010 03:24:15 +0000

As an unmarried woman without a child, I love this show. Sometimes I find it offensive just because a man who is unmarried without children in a great job is not looked upon as a loser while a woman in the same position is. However, if you imagine a man playing the Liz Lemon role, single and scattered, he would probably be some kind of losery comic relief just like she can be.

One thing that worries me (and sorry if someone already said this but there were so many comments I didn’t read them all) is that some people who watch one or two episodes of the show may not pick up on the satire and sigh, thinking to themselves that women just can’t get along without men when they see snippets of Liz and Jack’s relationship.

By: Is 30 Rock Feminist? Or, my eternal love for Liz Lemon. » Fringe Magazine

Is 30 Rock Feminist? Or, my eternal love for Liz Lemon. » Fringe Magazine — Fri, 10 Jul 2009 15:52:51 +0000

[...] anti-feminist and secretly conservative here. The Pursuit of Harpyness (one of my favorite blogs!)weighed in, and Bitch Magazine’s blog joined in on the discussion, too. (There was also a Maxim article [...]

By: Sylvia

Sylvia — Tue, 12 May 2009 21:13:22 +0000

This is very interesting to see, because we seem to have come from not-too-dissimilar ideological perspectives to arrive at opposite conclusions on both the show and the article. I’m a grouchy enough feminist woman and I was relieved to see Weiner’s piece because most of the issues he raises about the show have been bothering me for a long time, and I was wondering if I was literally the only viewer troubled by this.

And while I can see where you’re coming from, I don’t at all think his thesis is based primarily on Liz Lemon’s character having flaws. I think the show has, as the headline calls it, a “conservative streak” — it’s really vexing when it appears but it’s not present all the time, which is part of why it’s so confusing to try to pick out the strands.

By: Tiny Danza

Tiny Danza — Fri, 08 May 2009 07:52:37 +0000

I love the show but every time Liz refers to her weight, a little part of me dies.

By: DangerMouse

DangerMouse — Thu, 07 May 2009 21:58:54 +0000

Kithkin: (1) Agreed.

Mireille: I get it. It’s not like ZOMG A SHOW ABOUT A WOMAN AND WOMEN’S ISSUES… it’s just a show with a female main character.

By: rodriguez

rodriguez — Thu, 07 May 2009 21:06:01 +0000

I get your ambivalence, @SarahMC. I think the article in Slate makes a good case.

It’s disappointing to wonder, are there commercial reasons why Liz is portrayed this way? Or artistic reasons?

By: Spark

Spark — Thu, 07 May 2009 18:56:56 +0000

@SarahMC: Yeah, the last episode was a failure on the feminist front. (Except for, “Let’s go look at some naked daughters and moms!”) Changing water coolers and attending bachelor parties is NOT equality, and I was annoyed Liz/the show went along with the idea that it is.

By: SarahMC

SarahMC — Thu, 07 May 2009 18:50:45 +0000

I found it uncomfortable when Tracy made her put the new jug on the water cooler by herself. To me it came off as a mockery of equality between the sexes (i.e. feminism). I still laughed at the physical comedy though.
Ugh, I keep going back and forth about this.

By: Spark

Spark — Thu, 07 May 2009 18:38:31 +0000

I love 30 Rock, but there are definitely cringe-worthy moments. When the show first began, Liz was a lot closer to the caricature of the miserable, lonely career woman, who wants a boyfriend/family but can’t have it. To the point where I found it hard to enjoy the show–it felt a little sell-out to me. But over time the writing has gotten sharper (or maybe it’s a matter of more episodes means a more developed character). I love that Liz can be sexual and attractive (she got John Hamm!), but also a total dork.

By: kelsium

kelsium — Thu, 07 May 2009 18:32:27 +0000

@PhDork: Though, even if it is the case that some of the more subtle stereotype undermining may be flying over the heads of some viewers, and I am also hopeful that it isn’t, the good the show does is far from lost. The simple fact that “the hazards and compromises that a liberal feminist woman encounters” are being portrayed at all is a huge deal.
Now if we could just get someone to say “abortion” on television.