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	<title>Comments on: A Word about Words&#8230;</title>
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	<link>http://www.harpyness.com/2009/07/10/a-word-about-words/</link>
	<description>As narrated by the most charming and vicious women on the internet</description>
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		<title>By: Clichés That Are Dead As A Doornail (Or Should Be) - The Pursuit of Harpyness</title>
		<link>http://www.harpyness.com/2009/07/10/a-word-about-words/comment-page-2/#comment-69531</link>
		<dc:creator>Clichés That Are Dead As A Doornail (Or Should Be) - The Pursuit of Harpyness</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jul 2011 22:55:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.harpyness.com/?p=8512#comment-69531</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] year I blogged about how the Ledbury poetry festival asked poets to reveal their most hated words. This year at the [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] year I blogged about how the Ledbury poetry festival asked poets to reveal their most hated words. This year at the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: peenerbambina</title>
		<link>http://www.harpyness.com/2009/07/10/a-word-about-words/comment-page-2/#comment-12019</link>
		<dc:creator>peenerbambina</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 Jul 2009 14:38:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.harpyness.com/?p=8512#comment-12019</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I hate the current trend amongst British young people for using &quot;random&quot; to mean unusual or a bit exciting. Constantly. For example, &quot;I went out and got completely drunk and ended up sleeping in my clothes, it was completely random&quot;. Or upon seeing something such as a man in a bear suit in Tesco &quot;that is so random&quot;. Grrrrr. &quot;Basically&quot; and &quot;at the end of the day&quot; are another two. And the Manchester habit of saying &quot;was you&quot; instead of &quot;were you&quot;. I could go on...]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I hate the current trend amongst British young people for using &#8220;random&#8221; to mean unusual or a bit exciting. Constantly. For example, &#8220;I went out and got completely drunk and ended up sleeping in my clothes, it was completely random&#8221;. Or upon seeing something such as a man in a bear suit in Tesco &#8220;that is so random&#8221;. Grrrrr. &#8220;Basically&#8221; and &#8220;at the end of the day&#8221; are another two. And the Manchester habit of saying &#8220;was you&#8221; instead of &#8220;were you&#8221;. I could go on&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: More Words About Words - The Pursuit of Harpyness</title>
		<link>http://www.harpyness.com/2009/07/10/a-word-about-words/comment-page-2/#comment-12015</link>
		<dc:creator>More Words About Words - The Pursuit of Harpyness</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 20 Jul 2009 13:11:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.harpyness.com/?p=8512#comment-12015</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] my post on words we hate&#8211;which yielded an awesome comment thread about not just nit-picky word-hating, but on language [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] my post on words we hate&#8211;which yielded an awesome comment thread about not just nit-picky word-hating, but on language [...]</p>
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		<title>By: bellacoker</title>
		<link>http://www.harpyness.com/2009/07/10/a-word-about-words/comment-page-2/#comment-11528</link>
		<dc:creator>bellacoker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Jul 2009 02:52:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.harpyness.com/?p=8512#comment-11528</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[SarahMC:  Hmmm . . . I would not say that it&#039;s &quot;wrong&quot; to cringe when people misuse words, I would say that it&#039;s a little like cringing when someone uses the wrong fork at a dinner party.  You know? Understandable if you were raised knowing which is the &quot;proper&quot; fork to use, but perhaps a little fussy.

Language is a tool we use to make ourselves understood, and I would guess that, even using the wrong word, that person succeeded; just like the wrong fork transports the food to your mouth just fine.  

In a perfect world, both participants in any conversation, be it at a bank or at a bodega, would go out of their way to understand the people they interact with.  That this is not the case now highlights how language is a form of privilege, those with the privilege expect those without to do all of the heavy lifting that goes into making the conversation progress.  That probably won&#039;t change, but we should recognize that it happens, dontcha think?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>SarahMC:  Hmmm . . . I would not say that it&#8217;s &#8220;wrong&#8221; to cringe when people misuse words, I would say that it&#8217;s a little like cringing when someone uses the wrong fork at a dinner party.  You know? Understandable if you were raised knowing which is the &#8220;proper&#8221; fork to use, but perhaps a little fussy.</p>
<p>Language is a tool we use to make ourselves understood, and I would guess that, even using the wrong word, that person succeeded; just like the wrong fork transports the food to your mouth just fine.  </p>
<p>In a perfect world, both participants in any conversation, be it at a bank or at a bodega, would go out of their way to understand the people they interact with.  That this is not the case now highlights how language is a form of privilege, those with the privilege expect those without to do all of the heavy lifting that goes into making the conversation progress.  That probably won&#8217;t change, but we should recognize that it happens, dontcha think?</p>
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		<title>By: martha</title>
		<link>http://www.harpyness.com/2009/07/10/a-word-about-words/comment-page-2/#comment-11471</link>
		<dc:creator>martha</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Jul 2009 14:21:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.harpyness.com/?p=8512#comment-11471</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[i&#039;m a little late to this show, but the misuse of the following words drives me bonkers:

ironic, when the situation at hand is in now way ironic

literally, as in &quot;It&#039;s literally raining cats and dogs.&quot;

@BlueBears and BeckySharper and others, I also struggle with the BF/partner situation. I find when dealing with insurance, etc. I refer to him as &quot;partner.&quot; And when talking to people I always just use his name, because it sounds less juvenile than &quot;boyfriend.&quot; Of course, this irritates some people too, so there is not much win.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i&#8217;m a little late to this show, but the misuse of the following words drives me bonkers:</p>
<p>ironic, when the situation at hand is in now way ironic</p>
<p>literally, as in &#8220;It&#8217;s literally raining cats and dogs.&#8221;</p>
<p>@BlueBears and BeckySharper and others, I also struggle with the BF/partner situation. I find when dealing with insurance, etc. I refer to him as &#8220;partner.&#8221; And when talking to people I always just use his name, because it sounds less juvenile than &#8220;boyfriend.&#8221; Of course, this irritates some people too, so there is not much win.</p>
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		<title>By: SarahMC</title>
		<link>http://www.harpyness.com/2009/07/10/a-word-about-words/comment-page-2/#comment-11430</link>
		<dc:creator>SarahMC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Jul 2009 03:03:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.harpyness.com/?p=8512#comment-11430</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[K, it seems people are talking about a bunch of different things, which are being conflated.
There&#039;s spelling, grammar, dialect, definition, etc.  Taking liberties with language in a poetry class is different from being &lt;i&gt;sloppy&lt;/i&gt; in a cover letter.  Nobody has insisted that everyone speak and write &quot;proper&quot; English in every aspect of their lives.  But I agree with emilyanne that &quot;...we do people a disservice if we say that they don&#039;t have to know the correct meaning of words.&quot;  There&#039;s slang and then there&#039;s carelessness.  I am troubled that young people seem to think &quot;great&quot; and &quot;gr8&quot; are equally acceptable outside of text messaging.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>K, it seems people are talking about a bunch of different things, which are being conflated.<br />
There&#8217;s spelling, grammar, dialect, definition, etc.  Taking liberties with language in a poetry class is different from being <i>sloppy</i> in a cover letter.  Nobody has insisted that everyone speak and write &#8220;proper&#8221; English in every aspect of their lives.  But I agree with emilyanne that &#8220;&#8230;we do people a disservice if we say that they don&#8217;t have to know the correct meaning of words.&#8221;  There&#8217;s slang and then there&#8217;s carelessness.  I am troubled that young people seem to think &#8220;great&#8221; and &#8220;gr8&#8243; are equally acceptable outside of text messaging.</p>
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		<title>By: emilyanne</title>
		<link>http://www.harpyness.com/2009/07/10/a-word-about-words/comment-page-2/#comment-11427</link>
		<dc:creator>emilyanne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 21:12:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.harpyness.com/?p=8512#comment-11427</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[K - while i think on rereading everything that Bella and PS and you are all making really good points (and for a fantastic screed on this you should track down James Kelman&#039;s Booker prize acceptance speech in which he lambasts the &#039;colonisation&#039; of the Scottish language by English imperialists and sounds the trumpet resoundingly for colloquialisms) and I truly do think that novels in particular would be all the poorer if you wiped out/ignored patois etc and wrote only in standard English. I also agree that language needs to evolve and flourish and can&#039;t just be pinned down by people. 

However my objection is to the idea (not outlined by any of you I hasten to add but certainly increasingly allowed in certain schools) that text speak is a valid way to express yourself in the context of a school essay or that it doesn&#039;t matter if you can&#039;t spell as long as you are &#039;expressing yourself&#039;. I don&#039;t think that&#039;s true. I think that in the context of your school education learning the basics of grammar and spelling is important even you do not have to express yourself in them in later life. I just don&#039;t believe that self-expression is everything and I think we do people a disservice if we say that they don&#039;t have to know the correct meaning of words and that whether or not they like a book is more important than analysing the author (this is a different point though so sorry for going off track). 

As a sidenote, I object strongly to management speak and excessive legalese because it is ugly and unnecessary, but I accept that not every one has to agree with this opinion.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>K &#8211; while i think on rereading everything that Bella and PS and you are all making really good points (and for a fantastic screed on this you should track down James Kelman&#8217;s Booker prize acceptance speech in which he lambasts the &#8216;colonisation&#8217; of the Scottish language by English imperialists and sounds the trumpet resoundingly for colloquialisms) and I truly do think that novels in particular would be all the poorer if you wiped out/ignored patois etc and wrote only in standard English. I also agree that language needs to evolve and flourish and can&#8217;t just be pinned down by people. </p>
<p>However my objection is to the idea (not outlined by any of you I hasten to add but certainly increasingly allowed in certain schools) that text speak is a valid way to express yourself in the context of a school essay or that it doesn&#8217;t matter if you can&#8217;t spell as long as you are &#8216;expressing yourself&#8217;. I don&#8217;t think that&#8217;s true. I think that in the context of your school education learning the basics of grammar and spelling is important even you do not have to express yourself in them in later life. I just don&#8217;t believe that self-expression is everything and I think we do people a disservice if we say that they don&#8217;t have to know the correct meaning of words and that whether or not they like a book is more important than analysing the author (this is a different point though so sorry for going off track). </p>
<p>As a sidenote, I object strongly to management speak and excessive legalese because it is ugly and unnecessary, but I accept that not every one has to agree with this opinion.</p>
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		<title>By: K</title>
		<link>http://www.harpyness.com/2009/07/10/a-word-about-words/comment-page-2/#comment-11423</link>
		<dc:creator>K</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 17:09:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.harpyness.com/?p=8512#comment-11423</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[@SarahMC

Not to be nitpicky (even though that&#039;s kind of what this post is all about) but what you&#039;re saying doesn&#039;t make much sense from a linguistic standpoint. 

You &quot;don’t believe the upper-class white male standard of speech is “correct,” but DO believe that &quot;there are proper ways to use words and improper ways to use words&quot;? In the U.S. upper-class people, men and women both, are the ones that decide what is and is not proper in terms of language (and, if you&#039;ll recall, proper is a synonym of correct), so it would logically follow that you believe that their dialect IS the &quot;right&quot; one.

If that&#039;s not what you intended, what are you trying to say? That Standard American English (which is the dialect taught in schools and what most commenters seem to be advocating/typing in) is only &lt;i&gt;slightly&lt;/i&gt; more correct than other ways of speaking? That&#039;s a very dangerous line of thought, in my opinion. Setting up hierarchies doesn&#039;t usually get us anywhere positive as a society.

Granted, there are academic and journalistic standards when it comes to things written specifically for those contexts that are not likely to change anytime soon, but what does it matter if people don&#039;t follow the current prescribed language rules at all other times? My grandma is from a generation that never uses &#039;text&#039; as a verb. I&#039;m not. Does that mean her/their English is purer/better/more correct than mine?

Sorry for the spiel. I guess I should&#039;ve just said that I agree with Pilgrim Soul and bellacoker.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@SarahMC</p>
<p>Not to be nitpicky (even though that&#8217;s kind of what this post is all about) but what you&#8217;re saying doesn&#8217;t make much sense from a linguistic standpoint. </p>
<p>You &#8220;don’t believe the upper-class white male standard of speech is “correct,” but DO believe that &#8220;there are proper ways to use words and improper ways to use words&#8221;? In the U.S. upper-class people, men and women both, are the ones that decide what is and is not proper in terms of language (and, if you&#8217;ll recall, proper is a synonym of correct), so it would logically follow that you believe that their dialect IS the &#8220;right&#8221; one.</p>
<p>If that&#8217;s not what you intended, what are you trying to say? That Standard American English (which is the dialect taught in schools and what most commenters seem to be advocating/typing in) is only <i>slightly</i> more correct than other ways of speaking? That&#8217;s a very dangerous line of thought, in my opinion. Setting up hierarchies doesn&#8217;t usually get us anywhere positive as a society.</p>
<p>Granted, there are academic and journalistic standards when it comes to things written specifically for those contexts that are not likely to change anytime soon, but what does it matter if people don&#8217;t follow the current prescribed language rules at all other times? My grandma is from a generation that never uses &#8216;text&#8217; as a verb. I&#8217;m not. Does that mean her/their English is purer/better/more correct than mine?</p>
<p>Sorry for the spiel. I guess I should&#8217;ve just said that I agree with Pilgrim Soul and bellacoker.</p>
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		<title>By: BeckySharper</title>
		<link>http://www.harpyness.com/2009/07/10/a-word-about-words/comment-page-2/#comment-11420</link>
		<dc:creator>BeckySharper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 15:19:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.harpyness.com/?p=8512#comment-11420</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[@mischiefmanager: I totally second all of the above.  Despite my slavish love of English, I&#039;m not one of those people who thinks America has to be the land of the white person&#039;s standard English. Yes, we need a common dialect for work, school, business, etc. But regional accents, patois, dialect--I love &#039;em (and have kept a lot of my Southern accent/vocabulary despite 13 years in NYC).  I&#039;m also all for America being a place where people speak second languages--I grew up among a lot of people for whom English was a second language, and I don&#039;t get why the hell so many Americans feel threatened by it.  Being able to speak two languages makes you SMARTER, not dumber.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@mischiefmanager: I totally second all of the above.  Despite my slavish love of English, I&#8217;m not one of those people who thinks America has to be the land of the white person&#8217;s standard English. Yes, we need a common dialect for work, school, business, etc. But regional accents, patois, dialect&#8211;I love &#8216;em (and have kept a lot of my Southern accent/vocabulary despite 13 years in NYC).  I&#8217;m also all for America being a place where people speak second languages&#8211;I grew up among a lot of people for whom English was a second language, and I don&#8217;t get why the hell so many Americans feel threatened by it.  Being able to speak two languages makes you SMARTER, not dumber.</p>
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		<title>By: mischiefmanager</title>
		<link>http://www.harpyness.com/2009/07/10/a-word-about-words/comment-page-2/#comment-11418</link>
		<dc:creator>mischiefmanager</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 14:27:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.harpyness.com/?p=8512#comment-11418</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Maybe we can think of &quot;proper&quot; English as the common dialect among many in this country.  We don&#039;t have to say it&#039;s the best or the right one, just the one we&#039;ve agreed on as appropriate in common spaces such as work and school.  If we don&#039;t have a common speech, our cohesiveness as a nation (such as it is) will be threatened.  But dialects and accents are fascinating and precious and should be respected and preserved too.

As for obscure words, saying we should limit our vocabularies because not everyone understands the words we use is like saying that we should only have vanilla ice cream for dessert because some people don&#039;t know what creme brulee is.  Long and/or obscure words are the dessert of language!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe we can think of &#8220;proper&#8221; English as the common dialect among many in this country.  We don&#8217;t have to say it&#8217;s the best or the right one, just the one we&#8217;ve agreed on as appropriate in common spaces such as work and school.  If we don&#8217;t have a common speech, our cohesiveness as a nation (such as it is) will be threatened.  But dialects and accents are fascinating and precious and should be respected and preserved too.</p>
<p>As for obscure words, saying we should limit our vocabularies because not everyone understands the words we use is like saying that we should only have vanilla ice cream for dessert because some people don&#8217;t know what creme brulee is.  Long and/or obscure words are the dessert of language!</p>
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