The Kids Are Alright

22 Responses to “The Kids Are Alright”

1. PhDork says:

   November 17, 2009 at 8:54 am

   If this little dude is a “gay wad,” please add my name to the Official Register of Gaywads.

   Saw this yesterday afternoon. So simple, and so inarguable.
2. rodriguez says:

   November 17, 2009 at 9:22 am

   I’ve got a problem with the pledge too, besides Will’s point and besides the “under God” clause.

   Why do I need to say, out loud in front of others, that I pledge my allegiance to the US? How does mumbling a bunch of new speak prove I a loyal American?

   No one’s given me an acceptable answer to that yet, and until I hear one I’d rather not give my assent, however passive, to any group think.
3. BeckySharper says:

   November 17, 2009 at 10:03 am

   I truly don’t get why the Pledge is still required in schools. It seems so archaic and vaguely fascistic.

   The Supreme Court ruled in 1943 that it violates the Free Speech clause of the First Amendment to force people (schoolchildren in that case) to recite the Pledge ( West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette , 1943). I think schools should just drop the damn Pledge altogether.
4. sarah.of.a.lesser.god says:

   November 17, 2009 at 10:28 am

   @Rodriguez: Because we need to show we’re against the terrorists, not with them!

   Seriously, the Pledge is ridiculous. I never said it when I was in public school, and got a few dirty looks for my troubles. When I was in a private school, they never bothered with it, and I was really grateful for that. Of course, our student body was 1/3 foreign, so I’m not sure it would have gone over well if they had insisted on the pledge.
5. rainy_day says:

   November 17, 2009 at 11:25 am

   Okay, the guy interviewing this kid is kind of an asshat, but seriously, that kid is incredible.

   Also, I kind of completely forgot about the Pledge until I read this article, so that just goes to show you how effective it was at making me a loyal American.
6. PhDork says:

   November 17, 2009 at 11:27 am

   I remember that my 4th grade teacher taught us to say the Pledge without “under God” in it. At the time, I thought that was a little weird (because I learned it with that phrase included), now I think it was a pretty rad choice, even though I’m not sure of her reasoning.

   Aaaaand threaddrift!
7. mischiefmanager says:

   November 17, 2009 at 11:55 am

   Whatever that kid’s parents are doing, they should market it. Gaywads ftw!

   I had a politial science teacher in high school in the early ’70′s who deliberately omitted the Pledge. In those days, it was quite a statement, and, of course, we loved it, America-hating lefties that we were.

   Given how many kids (and adults) don’t even know what the words are or what they mean, it seems like a futile exercise. Five minutes of quiet meditation would probably be more productive.
8. DirtyLaundry says:

   November 17, 2009 at 12:38 pm

   I hope I don’t come off as a bitch for this but:

   1) I know he is only six and it is nice to see young kids take a stand against something, but the racism and sexism just seem to be an after thought for him and he would be quite fine saying the pledge had not gay marriage been an issue. I could be wrong, but I think he may only feel this way because somebody close to him is gay. People, especially children, usually (not always) don’t feel strongly for something unless it affects them personally. Or it could simply be from the fact that gay rights gets more news coverage these days.
   It just seems to me like gay rights are taken more seriously in comparison to the rights of women and minorities. Mainly because gay rights includes men and whites, where as rights for women and minorities include one or the other. There are a whole slew of other reasons for this, but I don’t think this post is the place to get into it. He does seem like a good kid though and I do hope he take these issues seriously or as seriously as a 10 year old can take them.

   2) Do you guys realize every country has a pledge? Are you guys anti-pledge or just anti-American pledge? When I was staying in a another country briefly I would just put my hand over my heart and not say anything, (1) because I didn’t know the words (2) out of respect for that country.
9. sarah.of.a.lesser.god says:

   November 17, 2009 at 12:53 pm

   @DirtyLaundry: No, I would never call you a bitch because you hold a differing opinion.

   1) He’s actually ten, not six. While it would be devastatingly awesome if he was just as gung-ho about all three, I’m uncomfortable with the idea that Phillips isn’t extremely commendable because his stance is predicated on protesting a certain prejudice that, it seems like, is something that affects people he knows. If the Lilly Ledbetter Act had been defeated and he was taking a stand and saying he wouldn’t pledge allegiance until a piece of legislation concerning women’s equality was passed, I don’t think I’d wonder why he wasn’t giving equal time to gay marriage in his stance. Also, as a bisexual woman, I’m leery of the notion that a child’s principled stance on American ideals and gay rights is automatically tempered by not giving equal time to other issues of prejudice and privilege. Again, he’s ten years old.

   It just seems to me like gay rights are taken more seriously in comparison to the rights of women and minorities.

   I’m really uncomfortable getting into setting up a pyramid of whose rights are getting/deserve the most coverage. Especially right after the repeal of marriage equality in Maine. We may be getting coverage, but I don’t see it translating into enough action.

   2) I was only at a school where the pledge was said for a very brief time, but I didn’t feel comfortable saying it because it feels like one of those compulsory shows of patriotism (like pressure for politicians to wear flag pins), as well as the fact that “Under God” is tacked onto the end. Would I judge someone who says the Pledge? Not at all. Am I “anti-pledge”? Nope. Am I saying that a person who says the pledge AND a person who does not say the pledge deserves respect? Yup.
10. DirtyLaundry says:

    November 17, 2009 at 1:48 pm

    I’m not sure why I put six in my first paragraph, but I know he’s ten, I even wrote it in my second paragraph.
    I do think what he is doing is very commendable, I just hope the continues to fights against injustice as he gets older, although being a lawyer may not be the best place for that it is a good place to start.

    “I’m really uncomfortable getting into setting up a pyramid of whose rights are getting/deserve the most coverage.”

    I never said certain rights deserve more coverage than others I said certain rights are taken more seriously than others. One of the reasons is it being a sign of the times. Women and minorities are thought to have their rights already in a “this isn’t the 1950s people” sort of way and have nothing more to complain about, where as gays do.
11. BeckySharper says:

    November 17, 2009 at 2:15 pm

    Do you guys realize every country has a pledge? Are you guys anti-pledge or just anti-American pledge?

    I very much doubt that every country in the world has a pledge of allegiance. Can you provide proof of that sweeping statement? Some have oaths of allegiance, but those countries generally don’t have their schoolkids reciting them on a regular basis the way the US does.

    Nor was this supposed to be a referendum about all pledges everywhere–it’s specifically talking about American schoolchildren and the American Pledge of Allegiance. I think that’s pretty clear from the post.
12. Pilgrim Soul says:

    November 17, 2009 at 2:21 pm

    Note: Canada has no pledge of allegiance. We used to do a moment of silence in the morning for respect for all faiths, but IIRC that disappeared sometime around high school.
13. DirtyLaundry says:

    November 17, 2009 at 2:45 pm

    I should have said most countries have a pledge not every.

    “…it’s specifically talking about American schoolchildren and the American Pledge of Allegiance. I think that’s pretty clear from the post.”
    Yeah I go that, but my point was that if one is so anti-American pledge shouldn’t one also be anti-pledge for every country. They all pretty much serve the same purpose for the most part. I don’t see how one can say the American pledge is stupid because one does not show their patriotism by standing in front a flag and reciting words, but not have a problem with the pledges of other countries.
14. Pilgrim Soul says:

    November 17, 2009 at 2:49 pm

    I am happy to declare myself anti-pledge. It’s claptrap.
15. baraqiel says:

    November 17, 2009 at 3:12 pm

    Maaaaaan, I refused to say the pledge all the time and a substitute teacher almost sent me to the principal’s office for it. Did I get on CNN? Nope. Bah. Kids these days.

    Well, good for him, anyway. I hope he perseveres even when doing the right thing doesn’t get him a ton of attention.
16. BeckySharper says:

    November 17, 2009 at 3:13 pm

    I would say that I’m anti-pledge both with regard to the American one AND pledges in general. I’m not a fan of jingoism in any form.

    That said, when it comes oaths of allegiance, I’m not going to tell people in other countries that they should give up their customs just because I believe those customs are antithetical to my own society’s values.
17. rodriguez says:

    November 17, 2009 at 3:56 pm

    I had to stand around with downcast eyes this Sat. at a social/charity event during the pledge, a prayer, and singing “God Bless America”. I’m anti-pledge: it’s all about creating a granfalloon.
18. mischiefmanager says:

    November 17, 2009 at 4:48 pm

    S.O.A.L.G. said: ” it feels like one of those compulsory shows of patriotism (like pressure for politicians to wear flag pins), as well as the fact that “Under God” is tacked onto the end.”

    It feels like that because that’s precisely what it is. According to Wikipedia, ” The Pledge of Allegiance was written in 1892 by Francis Bellamy (1855-1931), a Baptist minister, a Christian socialist…Harris’ original “Pledge of Allegiance” was published in the September 8th issue of the popular children’s magazine The Youth’s Companion as part of the National Public-School Celebration of Columbus Day, a celebration of the 400th anniversary of Christopher Columbus’s discovery of America. The event was conceived by James B. Upham, a marketer for the magazine, in a campaign to sell American flags and American nationalism to public schools.” The pledge was instituted in schools in 1892.

    So in other words, it was invented for a racist holiday to make money for a magazine. Kind of takes the glow off, doesn’t it?

    Not to pile on, DL, but I have to admire a kid that age who’s willing to take on his peers. That’s a tough act for any of us at any age, and he’s really handling it. I don’t have a problem at all with the idea that he was inspired by knowing gay people who have suffered discrimination-that’s how change happens, one person at a time. We all choose our battles. Maybe some other kid will be inspired by Will to choose ours.
19. DirtyLaundry says:

    November 18, 2009 at 1:42 am

    “We all choose our battles. Maybe some other kid will be inspired by Will to choose ours.”
    Don’t count on it. When it comes to picking and choosing battles, women’s issues are always last on the list. Think of it this way: you can probably name 10 celebs who have spoken out against Prop 8, but you can probably only name 2 or 3 who have spoken out against rape, domestic violence, or for abortion rights. It’s not necessarily that they don’t care, it’s just not a battle they care to fight for.
20. BeckySharper says:

    November 18, 2009 at 8:12 am

    @DirtyLaundry: If you lined up every celebrity and actress who’s participated in, say, Eve Ensler’s V-Day or Take Back the Night marches or pro-choice rallies, that would be WAY more than the ones who have protested Prop 8.

    Is there a particular reason this article makes you so damn cynical about people’s good intentions? I don’t get it.
21. PhDork says:

    November 18, 2009 at 2:48 pm

    rodriguez: “granfalloon” is my new favorite word. How did I get so far without ever learning it? Seriously, as a concept, it’s brilliant. I’m totally going to use it in my dissertation (which is about, among other things, American nationalism).
22. DirtyLaundry says:

    November 18, 2009 at 7:29 pm

    @BeckySharper: I hope it doesn’t sound like I’m attacking the little boy and what he is doing because I’m not. However, over the past few months I have become very disgruntled about civil rights especially women’s rights. And the whole Polanski thing was the tipping point. You hear people say they are for women’s rights and then slut shame a 13-year-old girl and say it wasn’t “rape-rape”. I hear people fight passionately for gay rights and then say if Rhianna goes back to Chris Brown she deserves what she gets. For some silly reason I just thought that those who take gay rights seriously would automatically take women’s issues seriously, but I’m finding that is not the case at all. It might be just me and my view of the of things, but those who do take women’s issues seriously seem to be in the minority not the majority.
    Maybe it is simple because gay rights is pretty straight forward, but for many [celebs] rape, domestic violence, and abortion tend to be complicated and controversial issues (although it shouldn’t be), so they don’t speak up about it.